Not sure if I want to touch the 8x going on right next door, but I'ma gonna lay out my own plans, here. Oh, and warning, for those who care: this is gonna be a long one. ^_^

CHANGE LOG: (It seems necessary. Don't judge me.)
5/12/11 - Finished current Skill list and Monster Tiers.
5/11/11 - Added Class tree proposal thingy. Began explanation of Skills.
5/4/11 - Started thread, outlined potential story.
5/5/11 - Explained preliminary Tier 3 customizing system.

This would be, as I hope you can tell, an FE8 prequel. Still very definitely in the planning stages. Storyline: original rise of the Demon King. Keep in mind here, most of the story is unplanned and the book I have all the thus-far planned mechanics written down in is not with me, so most of what I'm typing at the moment is either off the top of my head or ripped from Serenes Forest or the FE wiki. Also, I intend this to be extremely long; 50-ish chapters, ideally, plus some sort of creature campaign. Third tiers will be present with a level cap of 30 and, if things work out as I plan, customizable. There will be additional monsters as well, all with third-tiers. I liked most of the features in Sacred Stones, so branching tiers and a traversable world map will be available. Abusing Monster levels will be extremely difficult; more on that further down.


Story first.

[+] spoiler

As I said before, original rise of the Demon King. The state of the continent will probably involve multitudes of small, premature kingdoms with alliances and rivalries just starting to develop. One little nation (Caer Pelyn?) specializing in Dark Magic wielders, located where Darkling Woods is in FE8, probably, will turn out three Necromancer-figures of unprecedented power. These great Dark users begin creating monsters and spreading a general sense of chaos across the continent. So Caer Pelyn (?) begins conquering nations, eventually covering what will become Rausten, and all the other little nations start fighting amongst each other. 4 in particular come out on top, the precursors to Frelia, Renais, Grado and Jehanna. Latona (the Rausten Hero, if you need reminding) will probably be some important figure and will eventually be found travelling much like L'Arachel was. The first 5 or so chapters will follow this stage of consolidation, probably with Grado, before we get down to the Final Four, so to speak.

Anyway, caution will begin to set in and negotiations and such will take place, and then we get down to formation of the Fellowship. Sorta. The four Heroes, eventually with Latona in tow, will investigate Caer Pelyn (?). They'll conquer their way halfway in, appalled, of course, at the monstrosities they begin to fight, before things start to get hairy. Morva and Myyrh will swoop in to save the day, and lots of plot stuff will happen. After this I get a bit fuzzy on details. My best idea would be to hop on over to Lagdou Temple to consult some sort of deity, who gives them the Sacred Stones, maybe some Lord promotional items, and tells them to go kick some Monster ass.

So somehow they sneak into Caer Pelyn (?) and as it turns out, Formortiis has already been created. One of the Necromancers is dead, one is outright insane and the last one realizes the terrible mistake that's been made. Fortunately, the group happens upon the sane one and have most of the situation explained before the crazy one comes in and kills him; Formortiis is currently gathering more power and has made for himself 3 monster "Generals" The motley crew survives the crazy guy's onslaught until they somehow manage to escape, then sets out to kill the generals. More on them later on. So after fighting your way through a Valni-esque temple thing (you can retreat and replay, but levels provide 1/4 experience and little or no items after the first time), the first General is dead.

Suddenly, word is received, simultaneously, of attacks on Renais, Frelia and Jehanna. You decide who to go with, and two kingdoms are saved. One of them is destroyed. You'll get rare items from the two saved ones, but not the other. I'm not sure what'll decide which one gets sacked, probably just your initial choice. Anyway, that'll probably last 10 chapters or so, providing experience you'll definitely need. Then it's off to topple the next (two?) generals before a regroup with Morva and a revisit to the deity. Now equipped with the Sacred Twins, off you go to slay Formortiis. That'll probably take at least 5 chapters, maybe 10. And he won't be anywhere near as easy as he was in FE8.

So, after Formortiis is dead, the crazy Necromancer dude runs away. There'll be a mini-ending, but the story will continue; now you have to search the generals' haunts. After beating the first fortress/temple within a certain number of turns, you'll arrive at the last floor in time to see him ReWarp away. This will happen once or twice more before you get the chance to kill him. That'll mark the official ending, but I'd love to see if we can't find a way to make the creature campaign worth making further.

Customizable 3rd Tiers?

[+] spoiler

I've always loved the concept of third tiers, but I really liked the Branching class system in FE8. Making two separate Tier 3 classes for every tier 2 seemed rather impractical, though, and would inevitably leave some unsatisfied. So customizability seemed the way to go. Keep in mind, btw, that although these'll sound a little OP, I would intend to make it necessary to make them this strong if you intend to survive the Endgame stuff.

So. It'll revolve around a point system. I figure 1 point per level gained, plus another point for every 10 wins. That'll probably need tweaking, but it's a start. I'll explain my reasons for the cost of each as I go, if I feel it's necessary.

Also, baseline bonuses: Stat caps will be raised to 150%, rounded down. Health cap bumps up by 30 points. Stats will be raised by 10% of their respective growth values; 5% for Health. I'm not sure how Con will work yet, but we shall see.

Raising the cap on a stat by 10%: 2 pts, up to 5 times (200% original).
Increase Health cap by 5: 3 points, up to 6 times.
Increase a stat by 1: 3 points.
---(Higher costs keep stat items relevant)
Increase stat growths by 5%: 7 points. -2 points for -5%.
New weapon classes: 5 points for 1, 12 points for 2, 25 points for 3.
Extend Range of distance attacks to 3: 8 points.
Increasing Movement by 1: 4 points, up to 150% original.
Changing terrain movement costs: -1 cost for 3 points, +1 cost for -1 point.
---If that isn't clear: increasing movement cost gives you an extra point.
Add new terrain type: 5 points with a starting cost of 3. Removal: -2 points.
Adding a critical bonus: 5 points for 5%, up to 6 times. -2 points for -5%
Add a mount:
- 5 points for horse; +2 mov, new terrain costs, Canto 1, added weakness.
- 15 points for Pegasus/Wyvern; +3 mov, no terrain costs, Canto 1, 2 weaknesses.
- 5 points to upgrade from horse to Flying.
Remove weaknesses: 10 points; add weakness: -3 points.
---Things like Hammers on Armor, Wind on Pegasi, Fire on Cavalry, etc.
Raise Weapon level Cap: 5 points. Max of SS.
Add Lv. 1 Skill: 5 points. Lv. 2: 10 points. Lv. 3: 15 points.
-Upgrade skill: add original cost. Upgrade up to two times.
---Will be further explained later on. Most skills are modified from RD.
Increase Skill activation odds: 5 points for 5%, 2 times only. Does not apply to Mastery.
Add Mastery skill: No cost.
Change Affinity: 25 points.
---As I understand, support bonuses can be a big deal.

Class Tree

[+] spoiler

Clicky.

Empty spots are where I haven't decided on the third-tier names yet. I'll put in something to indicate what weapons and skills they can use by default.

Skills

[+] spoiler

Levels 1-3. Add on customized level-up, upgrade up to 2 times.

Resolve - Lv. 3: If HP<50%, Skill and Speed are 1.5x normal.
Upgrade 1: Def and Res are 1.5x normal, plus a 15% critical bonus.
Upgrade 2: Strength is 1.5x normal, plus another 15% critical bonus.

Savior - Lv. 1: Negates negative bonuses for rescuing an ally.
Upgrade 1: Allows Rescue and Drop/Give within the same turn.
Upgrade 2: Heals rescued ally for 50% of max health.

Gamble - Lv. 2: Allows for 2x critical chance at halved accuracy. Battle Command.
Upgrade 1: Also boosts base damage to 1.5x original.
Upgrade 2: Guarantees a critical.

Vantage - Lv. 3: (Speed)% chance of attacking before enemy.
Upgrade 1: (Speed/2)% chance of attacking twice. (Adept-style)
Upgrade 2: (Strength/2)% chance of canceling enemy's attack.

Renewal - Lv. 1: Restores 12.5% of max health at the beginning of each turn.
Upgrade 1: Extends the effect to adjacent squares. Increases to 20%.
Upgrade 2: Extends the effect to a 3-square radius.

Provoke - Lv. 1: Increases odds of being attacked among a group.
Upgrade 1: Will always be the priority target.
Upgrade 2: Reduce attacking enemy's Accuracy and Defense by 15%.

Miracle - Lv. 1: A lethal attack will instead leave user with 1 HP. (Luck)% chance.
Upgrade 1: Also immobilizes attacker.
Upgrade 2: Doubles odds of occurrence.

Daunt - Lv. 2: Enemies within a 3-square radius have -15% Acc and Crit.
Upgrade 1: Has the reverse effect on allies.
Upgrade 2: Doubles effect on adjacent squares.

Canto - Lv. 1: Use remaining movement after neutral action.
Upgrade 1: Use remaining movement after any action.
Upgrade 2: Add (Mov/2) extra squares to remaining movement.

Pick - Lv. 1: Use a lockpick to open chests and doors.
Upgrade 1: Open chests and doors without a lockpick.
Upgrade 2: Enemies no longer block your path.

Steal - Lv. 2: Steal items from enemies.
Upgrade 1: Steal unequipped weapons.
Upgrade 2: Steal equipped weapons; 30% chance to steal adjacent attacking enemy's weapon.

Wrath - Lv. 2: If HP<35%, Critical chance is increased by 50.
Upgrade 1: Speed and Skill are multiplied by 1.5x.
Upgrade 2: Strength is multiplied by 1.5x, Speed is now 2x original.

Cancel - Lv. 3: Cancels enemy counter; (Speed)% chance.
Upgrade 1: (Skill)% chance of attacking in place of enemy. (1 extra attack)
Upgrade 2: Enemies will not counter.

Shade - Lv. 1: Reduces chance of being attack among a group.
Upgrade 1: Enemies will not attack unless only one in range.
Upgrade 2: Increases Avoid/Dodge/Whatever by 20%.

Nihil - Lv. 2: Negates enemy criticals.
Upgrade 1: Negates enemy skills.
Upgrade 2: Negates enemy's effective attacks.

Adept - Lv. 3: (Skill)% chance of inducing Brave effect.
Upgrade 1: 20% critical bonus on extra attacks.
Upgrade 2: Extra attacks ignore enemy defenses.

Shove - Lv. 1: Push ally onto traversable square if Str > Con.
Upgrade 1: Option to use item on ally before shove.
Upgrade 2: Continue turn after shove.

Pavise - Lv. 3: (Skill/2)% chance of receiving no damage.
Upgrade 1: Returns half the damage that would have been done to the attacker.
Upgrade 2: Doubles chance of occurrence.

Blossom - Lv. 2: 1/2 exp gain. Rerolls if a stat does not raise upon level-up.
Upgrade 1: Enables second roll for all stats at 1/2 growths.
Upgrade 2: 75% exp gain.

Dragon Tide - Manakete only, Lv. 3: +5 to Strength and Skill in adjacent squares.
Upgrade 1: Extends effect to 3-square radius.
Upgrade 2: Also adds +5 to Magic and Speed.

White Pool - Dracozombies only: +5 to Defense and Resistance in adjacent squares.
Upgrade 1: Extends effect to 3-square radius.
Upgrade 2: 5-square radius, also adds +5 to Speed and Skill.

Blood Tide - Demons only: +5 to Strength and Magic in adjacent squares.
Upgrade 1: Extends effect to 3-square radius.
Upgrade 2: 5-square radius, also adds +5 to Speed, Skill, Defense and Resistance.

Pierce - Ignores enemy defenses. 25% chance of occurrence.
-Latent; Wyvern Knights. Upgrade to Mastery.

Silencer - 50% chance for critical strikes to kill instantly.
-Latent; Assassins. Upgrade to Mastery.

Summon - Summon a Phantom with 1 HP at caster's level.
-Latent; Summoners. Upgrade to Mastery.

Mastery Skills.

Aether - 2 hits at 1.5x Strength: First hit restores HP equal to damage dealt, second hit ignores Defense.
- 25% chance of activation. Used by Vanguards.

Astra - 3 hits, ignores Defense.
- 20% chance of activation. Used by Trueblades.

Bane - Reduces enemy HP to 1. Only activates on first attack.
- 35% chance of activation. Used by Whispers.

Colossus - Triples strength, doubles Skill for one attack. Can critical.
- 25% chance of activation. Used by Reavers and Champions.

Deadeye - Quadruples damage and immobilizes.
- 20% chance of activation. Used by Snipers.

Flare - Ignores Resistance, restores HP equal to damage dealt.
- 20% chance of activation. Used by Archsages, (Elder Third Tier), and (Valkyrie Third Tier).

Impale - 5 times normal damage.
- 20% chance of activation. Used by Sentinels and Seraph Knights.

Ire - Triples Strength.
- 25% chance of activation. Used by Manakete.

Keen Eye - Doubles Strength and Skill, ignores defenses for one hit. Can critical.
- 25% chance of activation. Used by (Wyvern Trooper Third Tier) and (Nomad Trooper Third Tier).

Luna - Triples Strength, ignores Defense.
- 25% chance of activation. Used by Marshalls and Centurions.

Overload - Consumes half of max HP. Doubles Power, uses 2 tomes with 1 sword.
- Activated by command. Used by Arcane Warriors.
(A note on Mageblades and ArWa's - Str and Mag are combined into Power, as are their growths, upon promotion.)

Pierce - Negates defenses and counterattacks, restores HP equal to damage dealt. Immobilizes.
- 35% chance of activation. Used by Wyvern Lords.

Rage - For 3 turns, 2x Str, -30% Acc, induces Friendly Berserk (Only attacks enemies). Cannot be healed for the duration.
- Activated by command. Used by Juggernauts.

Retribution - Attacks will be effective during engagement.
-Always affects monsters. 30% chance at beginning of all other battles. Used by Saints, Judgements, and (Templar Third Tier).

Sol - Triples damage, restores HP equal to damage dealt.
-25% chance of activation. Used by (Paladin Third Tier) and (Great Knight Third Tier).

Stun - Triples damage restores HP equal to damage dealt, immobilizes enemy.
-25% chance of activation. Used by Falcon Lords and Dragon Masters.

Umbra - Instantly kills opponent.
-25% chance of activation. Used by Shadows.

Summon - Call a creature of your own level.
-Activated by command. Used by Shadowcasters.
-Summon up to 3 monsters at once, up to cap.
-Cap of 1 point at level one, upgraded by 1 at levels 5, 10, 15, 20, and 30.
1 pt: Phantom - 1 HP, wields Swords, Axes, Lances.
2 pts: Spectre - 1 HP, 25% critical bonus, wields knives.
3 pts: Hellhound - Wields Fangs. (Midway between Mauthe Doog and Gwyllgi, statwise)
4 pts: Wight - Wields Swords, Lances, and Bows.
5 pts: Lesser Demon - Wields Demon Magic. (Not to be confused with Monster Magic)

Needs balancing, yet. I'm hoping to make them more than glorified criticals.

Monster Tiers

[+] spoiler

Names may need retooling. I'll list the name, then traits in parentheses. S means Swords, A means Axes, L means Lances, B means Bows, K means Knives, M means monster weapons, D means Monster magic. Demon magic (X) will be a special case; traits will vary widely, whether damage type, effectiveness, Wep triangle, or Range. A percentage indicates critical bonuses. Skills will be stated. If only two are listed, that means Second and Third Tiers only.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Corpse (M) ---> Revenant (M) ---> Entombed (M)

Mogall (D) ---> Arch Mogall (D) ---> Nightmare (D)

Bonewalker (S, L, ---> Wight (S, L, B, Adept 1) ---> Lich (S, L, B, Adept 2)

Spectre (K, +20%) ---> Shade (K, D, +20%) ---> Wraith (K, D, +35%)

Mauthe Doog (M, +10%) ---> Gwyllgi (M, +15%) ---> Black Shuck (M, +20%)

Gargoyle (L) ---> Deathgoyle (L) ---> Balrog (L, X)

Mactan (M) ---> Bael (M) ---> Elder Bael (M)

Centaur (B) ---> Tarvos (A, ---> Maelduin (A,

Gorgon (D, Daunt 1) ---> Medusa (D, Daunt 3)

Cyclops (A, Wrath 1) ---> Jotunn (L, A, S, Wrath 2)

Dracozombie (M, White Pool 1) ---> Pale Dragon (M, White Pool 2)

Lesser Demon (X, Blood Tide 1) ---> Greater Demon (X, D, Blood Tide 2)

Bosses

Reaper - S, L, D, 20%. Combination between Lich and Wraith.

Titan - A, L, Wrath 3. Version of Jotunn.

Demented Dragon - M, White Pool 3. Upgrade to Pale Dragon.

Demon King - X, D, Blood Tide 3. Upgrade to Greater Demon.

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And that's all I've come up with so far. As for the names - Lich, Balrog and Pale Dragon are sort of a tribute to FE Gaiden. Nightmare and Medusa seemed appropriate, and I couldn't come up with anything besides Corpse and Centaur. Mactan is from the scientific name of the Black Widow, but it could use some replacing. Jotunn is Norse, I think, and it meant giants or superhuman warriors or something. The Black Shuck is, like the Mauthe Doog and the Gwyllgi, a legendary dog in England. Though I suppose the Gwyllgi is Welsh. W/e.

That's everything short of weapon stats, which, sadly, I have planned already. Suggestions?

Firstly, DB has a huge backstory for his game already written and it looks like yours might interfere with his, which is why you should likely IM with him or something and discuss the plot. That or join his team and help him out with his.

I'm really glad that people are going to elaborate on Magvel a bit more. That game doesn't recieve as much love and FE7 is being killed with the glut of prequels/sequels to it. Guilty here

Klokinator @ May 4 2011, 07:08 PM wrote: Firstly, DB has a huge backstory for his game already written and it looks like yours might interfere with his, which is why you should likely IM with him or something and discuss the plot.

I'm really glad that people are going to elaborate on Magvel a bit more. That game doesn't recieve as much love and FE7 is being killed with the glut of prequels/sequels to it. Guilty here

Uh, what exactly prevents someone from coming up with their own backstory for something...? Just because someone else has come up with a fanon (fan canon), doesn't mean that said fanon is automatically law for everyone else. It's called being creative and unique. (And, while coming up with a story that's heavily based on an existing work inherently loses out in the creative department compared to something that's been thoughtfully planned out completely from scratch, one can still exercise some form of independence and come up with their own ideas.)

(Personally, I'm not a fan of Magvel's plot, let alone the idea of creating derivative projects based in existing canon (prequels/sequels). (I can stomach FE7x since it's leading up to a Renaissance in FE projects, but it would be even more impressive if it wasn't based in Elibe.))

------------------

@Ratiqu - Do remember that Fomortiis is only locked away prior to FE8, not slain. Also, you'll have to consider world map event editing, which, to my knowledge, has not been readily attempted. If you're confident on this course of action, I can only say good luck, since it seems to be a fairly ambitious project, and projects tend to not get completed often in the FE fandom.

@ both the above: don't worry too much about conflicting storylines. As I said, this is in preliminary planning stages and just about everything is open to debate and/or change.

And you're correct, Glenn, he is only locked away. When I said "dead", I really meant "defeated". So whatever.

I'll probably put up more of mah plans later today.

EDIT: Customizing system is up.

Hm. There's a lot loaded on your plate already (balancing t3s is hard enough, let alone a creature campaign) so throwing customisable characters into the mix is a bold move. Best of luck.

Also, you didn't state this anywhere in the above post. .__.

Rom hack or FEXP? Based on the customization you'll need I'm guessing FEXP. (Plus this is posted on the FE7x site of all places)

FEXP, probably.

Added a link to initial class tree and began a skill list. Ask if you have questions, suggest if you have suggestions.

Seriously, guys. As I've said before, I'm still planning this. For the moment, ignore any difficulties in coding and if you have ideas to help or that you think would be cool or any input whatsoever, please put it in.

Though I suppose it'll help once I get everything laid out. Anyway, sorry for the absence, life has been busy.

Oh gee, planning to use Yeti's classes or make your own? Half of those won't be in there.

My own, though many will be modified from Yeti's version. Elder, for example: He's gonna have Anima and Dark. Shamans will be back to dark, too; the connotation ruins them using anima for me.

Finishing Mastery list now, will start monster list if I have time.

> Implying new classes will be released with the engine

Ohmagawd I've been noticed.

Everything I'd had planned is laid out now, short of weapons stats.

Also, can I get some opinions on separating Anima into its components? I always thought it was stupid, if only because you had two new weapon levels to raise. I'm wondering, though, if it's possible to keep it as one class while still retaining an internal dominance triangle. Hmm.

BwdYeti @ May 12 2011, 09:42 PM wrote: > Implying new classes will be released with the engine

This. Yeti isn't planning to release his classes. However, if other people make his classes for him, they'll probably be released. Therefore the more people that help Yeti sprite his classes, the more new classes will be in the kit, see?

Although I may only be correct because Yeti only releases Stickmen for classes that are recieving facelifts. Copletely custom classes, like Elder for example, will likely be his work entirely.

Ratiqu @ May 13 2011, 07:54 AM wrote: Also, can I get some opinions on separating Anima into its components? I always thought it was stupid, if only because you had two new weapon levels to raise. I'm wondering, though, if it's possible to keep it as one class while still retaining an internal dominance triangle. Hmm.

It is stupid. Attacking high-res units with mages is silly; they should be destroying armours and pesky cavs and such. The dark>anima>light triangle never gets used, so a second one just unnecessarily complicates things (and yeah, gives them two extra weapon levels to maintain). Yeti and I have argued this point a thousand times, actually :R

Also, pierce upgrades at third tier? That's interesting.

@Bladesages: 'arcane knight' or 'arcane warrior' is an old favourite of mine

Solution: Have some magic users with not high Res
Precedent: every physical unit with not high Def (Myrms, Archers, IS FE Mercs, Pegs, sometimes Fighters and Brigands)

^ lieks. So if possible, when the time comes around, I'll hold on to the internal anima triangle.

@Myke - Arcane Warrior is sexy. I'll change that now. And yeah, Pierce upgrades. I like Masteries, I don't like criticals with fancy names. And the CC will be hard. I actually think it might be a bit underpowered at this point, compared with the others.

I need more third-tier names. Centurion and Raider got bumped up because I found intermediate names that I thought worked. I could maybe use Gold and Silver Knight for Great Knight and Paladin. Idk for anything else.

'Kay. I need to find something to help on in FE7x, now. I'll try spriting or something, maybe...

EDIT: I think I've got the legendaries figured out now. I'll put up weapon stat proposals before too long, here. Maybe tomorrow; I probly won't have time today.

Otherwise, I had two significant thoughts. One, allow troubadours and clerics to use knives. Or all magic units, for that matter. Two, modify Nomads so the class train thing goes Scout-->Nomad-->Nomad Trooper.

EDIT2: Another thought: Templar ---> Crusader